AI Summary:
The meeting included a mix of regular participants and new members, notably including Tom Haymes who was joining for the first time. The meeting focused on exploring fun and unrealistic work in XR, with demonstrations from Fabien Benetou and discussions about various aspects of spatial computing and document interaction.
Frode Hegland, Tom Haymes, Fabien Benetou, Brandel Zachernuk, Rob Swigart, Peter Wasilko, Mark Anderson, Leon van Kammen, Alan Laidlaw, Keith Martin
AI: Summary
This meeting focused on exploring playful and experimental aspects of XR, deliberately setting aside typical constraints to encourage creative thinking. Key discussions included Fabien’s demonstration of a document management system in XR, Tom Haymes’ insights about knowledge navigation and visualization, and various perspectives on how spatial computing could enhance document interaction and understanding. The conversation frequently returned to themes of play, curiosity, and the importance of maintaining childlike wonder when exploring new technologies. Participants shared personal experiences and anecdotes about their interactions with various technologies and discussed how different perceptual capabilities influence technology design.
AI: Speaker Summary
Frode Hegland
Led the meeting and facilitated discussions, particularly interested in how different types of XR experiences (seated, standing, room-scale) create distinct interaction paradigms. He emphasized the importance of understanding neurotypical differences in how people perceive and interact with spatial computing environments.
Tom Haymes
New to the group, shared insights about knowledge navigation and visualization, particularly interested in using AI to analyze and connect information in documents. Emphasized the importance of being able to see connections between ideas and moving beyond traditional linear document formats.
Fabien Benetou
Demonstrated his XR document management system and discussed the importance of playful exploration in technology. Shared various “hacker tools” and emphasized the importance of being able to repurpose tools beyond their intended use.
Brandel Zachernuk
Contributed insights about embodied cognition and extended mind theory, particularly interested in how spatial sense isn’t exclusively visual. Discussed the importance of proper representation of sound and acoustics in XR environments.
Rob Swigart
Shared historical perspectives, including experiences with Gregory Bateson and insights about perception extending beyond physical bodies. Discussed ancient cave navigation techniques using sound.
Peter Wasilko
Participated in discussions about document interaction and spatial computing, particularly interested in Benedictine Cyberspaces concepts.
Mark Anderson
Contributed perspectives on spatial hypertext work and the importance of agency in tool use. Discussed the balance between automation and user control in information visualization.
Leon van Kammen
Participated in discussions about 3D models and file formats, interested in unifying different 3D file format standards.
Alan Laidlaw
Shared insights about visualization and interface design, particularly interested in non-visual interfaces like audio-based Sudoku. Discussed semantic zooming concepts.
Keith Martin
Contributed to discussions about photography and technology, particularly interested in lock-picking as a form of physical puzzle-solving.
AI: Topics Discussed
WebXR:
Fabien demonstrated a system for document management in WebXR
The system allows drag-and-drop functionality for documents
Includes conversion capabilities for different file formats
Features transparent hand visualization when moving objects
Implements command systems accessible through spatial interfaces
Gestures:
Pinch gestures for moving and executing commands
Left hand for command activation, right hand for movement
Transparent hand visualization when moving objects
Discussion of seated vs standing interactions in VR
Symposium:
Brief mention of previous testing and demonstrations at the symposium in Vancouver. Discussion of upload functionality and drag-and-drop aspects demonstrated there
Book:
Multiple mentions of books and writing
Discussion of Future of Text books
Tom Haymes mentioned his book “Discovering Digital Humanity”
Discussion of Max Bennett’s “Brief History of Intelligence”
Other Topics Discussed:
Embodied cognition and extended mind theory
Spatial audio and acoustics in XR
Non-visual interfaces and accessibility
Semantic zooming and document navigation
Play and experimentation in technology
Neural diversity and different ways of perceiving
Lock-picking as metaphor for hacking and creative problem-solving
Cave paintings and authenticity of experience
AI’s role in document analysis and connection-making
Interesting Anecdotes:
Fabien’s story about visiting (or not visiting) Lascaux cave as a child
Rob’s experience with FBI lock-picking class
Tom’s discussion of Claude Shannon’s ultimate machine
Alan’s discussion of balloon-based task visualization
Discussion of Star Wars droids as neither fully sentient nor fully machine
AI: Concepts Introduced
Semantic Zooming (Alan Laidlaw): The concept of being able to view information at different levels of detail and abstraction, similar to but more complex than map zooming
Agency in Tools (Mark Anderson): The importance of user control and involvement in tools, rather than purely automated solutions
Extended Mind Theory (Brandel Zachernuk): How our perception extends beyond our physical bodies, including tools and environmental interactions
Non-Euclidean Document Navigation (Mark Anderson): Suggested as a potential approach to viewing connections between different parts of large documents
AI: People Mentioned
Howard Rheingold – mentioned by Frode as having introduced Tom to the group and author of “Tools for Thought”,
Claude Shannon – discussed by Tom Haymes in context of playful exploration and innovation at Bell Labs,
Gregory Bateson – mentioned by Rob Swigart regarding 1974 workshop about perception systems,
Doug Engelbart – referenced by Tom regarding augmenting human capabilities,
Ted Nelson – referenced by Tom regarding Xanadu project and breaking down ideas,
Les Carr – mentioned by Frode as a professor,
Ken Perlin – mentioned by Brandel regarding graphics and simulation,
Jared Bendis – mentioned by Tom as friend working with 3D at Case Western University,
Dene (mentioned as lead PI now at Washington State University Vancouver) – referenced by Frode
AI: Product or Company Names Mentioned
Apple Vision Pro – mentioned by Brandel in context of web standards development,
Bell Labs – discussed in context of Claude Shannon’s work,
Google’s Notebook LM – mentioned by Tom for document analysis,
Quest 3 – mentioned by Peter as his VR headset,
Half-Life Alyx – mentioned by Brandel regarding VR fidelity,
Xanadu – referenced regarding Ted Nelson’s work,
Zotero – mentioned by Fabien regarding bibliographic management,
Lego – mentioned by Fabien as prototyping tool,
Star Wars – discussed by Frode regarding interface metaphors,
iPhone – mentioned regarding spatial audio features,
Tailwind – mentioned regarding styling capabilities,
Papaparse – mentioned regarding CSV processing,
SheetJS – mentioned regarding Excel file processing
AI: Other
The meeting demonstrated a strong emphasis on experimental and playful approaches to technology, which was particularly fitting given the meeting’s theme of “Fun & Unrealistic Work in XR”. The discussions showed how removing typical constraints can lead to innovative thinking about spatial computing and document interaction.
Chat Log URLs:
https://notebooklm.google/
https://poly.pizza/search/ballon
https://aframe.io/docs/1.6.0/components/animation.html
https://freesound.org/people/deraj/sounds/202230/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunt_the_Wumpus
https://futuretextlab.info/xr-spaces-differing-perspectives/
https://youtu.be/30RX1yi2V9c?si=nzP4thTm98HXx4YJ
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lascaux
https://flipperzero.one
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LockPickingLawyer
Chat Log Summary:
There was significant discussion about play, learning, and various tools and technologies. Participants shared resources about 3D models, audio experiments, and technical documentation. The chat also captured several side conversations about lock-picking, photography, and various technical implementations.
The topic of future spaces in XR is important because:
- It represents a fundamental shift in how we interact with information
- It has the potential to overcome limitations of traditional 2D interfaces
- It allows for more natural and intuitive ways of organizing and accessing information
- It can accommodate different cognitive and perceptual styles
- It provides opportunities for new forms of collaboration and communication
- It challenges traditional assumptions about document structure and navigation
- It enables new ways of understanding and visualizing complex information
- It can potentially make information more accessible to different types of learners
- It allows for experimentation with new interface paradigms
- It may help bridge the gap between digital and physical interaction modes
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